Comments on: Back to the Dark Ages

By: Points of Interest, #33 « Mind, Soul, and Body

Points of Interest, #33 « Mind, Soul, and Body — Sat, 11 Oct 2008 16:43:20 +0000

[...] At Mormon Organon, Steve reflects on an Islamic author who laments the loss of a once vibrant and flourishing Muslin culture to whom the West owes much more than it realizes, Steve argues that the cultural switching of Dark Ages stagnation and Renaissance has come about largely through the r…. [...]

By: Doc

Doc — Thu, 09 Oct 2008 22:59:47 +0000

Steve,
Nice post, I would add that fundamentalism also seems to be building on the side of the atheists with Christopher Hitchens, Richard Dawkins, Bill Maher and the like. I don’t see that leading to any kind of enlightenment, only the same animosity and fear.

By: S.Faux

S.Faux — Wed, 08 Oct 2008 00:47:36 +0000

Religion is best served by embracing freedom in science. Science is best served by embracing freedom of religion.

By: Dave Collingridge

Dave Collingridge — Tue, 07 Oct 2008 13:28:00 +0000

Good post, Steve. Fundamentalism in any form is an enemy of critical analysis which is a hallmark of scientific activity. A free and open exchange of ideas is needed for intellectual endeavors to progress. Islam is a perfect example of the end result.
Although, I am not concerned about the west falling into the same trap. Granted, there are some warning signs around as you suggest.

By: ujlapana

ujlapana — Sat, 04 Oct 2008 02:03:02 +0000

Fundamentalism is “even found among some members of the church?”. That’s a very generous way of describing most Mormons. I think survey data tends to put us at the extreme–high percentages of Mormons believe in a literal Satan, literal Eden, etc. Surveys of the general public don’t get into this, but obviously literal belief in gold plates, angels, and Egyptian translations are also the definite norm in our religion. And there’s almost no tolerance for publicly disagreeing with these things. Someone who has such a hard time getting on nothingwavering ought to appreciate that he’s surrounded by that against which he fights!

By: SteveP

SteveP — Fri, 03 Oct 2008 16:06:58 +0000

I’ve noticed that too in politics, but I’ve felt it personally, where my opinion is dismissed because I have an education. Really. I’m not one of the regular people anymore so you don’t have to pay attention to my opinion.

smw makes an important point about accepting God’s will about anything that happens. It must have been meant to be is something I’ve had a hard time escaping.

CEF, I’ve often wondered about that. What would happen if we taught to the highest in us. It might inspire people to catch up. The worry is of course that they will be left behind, but usually being behind inspires me to catch up. What if we taught to the “highest in us.” I think it would increase our depth rather than drag us into mediocrity.

By: Velska

Velska — Fri, 03 Oct 2008 11:08:03 +0000

Well it seems to be pretty common to hold being civilized in derision (I can’t quite see how some LDS people can reconcile that with how much education has been promoted). One finger could be pointed at anti-intellectual attitudes so prevalent not only within different churches, but society in general.

I am not in favor of any political party, but there is something in the fact that John Kerry had to hide his multiple language skills for the risk of being considered a snob. Or that Obama’s Harvard education is being used against him in painting him an “elitist”.

Other than that, I believe that intellect and faith are both required in the long run, although in isolated circumstances one seems to be the favorite asset.

By: smw

smw — Thu, 02 Oct 2008 21:51:51 +0000

There is a Hadith saying that goes as follows:

Trust in God, but tie up your camel.

Fundamentalism seems to be the trust without the tying.

It is backing away from personal responsibility and abdicating all responsibility to God.

It is trusting in God’s prosperity without an attempt to get an education.

It is trusting in God’s healing blessings without physical exercise.

It is trusting in God fixing cars without regular maintenance.

It is accepting anything that happens as God’s will.

If God has a will for us, surely it is for us to use our agency to make choices and then act on those choices in a way that advances us on the spiritual pathway. We must earn bread by the sweat of our brow and not by praying on our knees. Praying isn’t going to cook the dinner. If you are hungry, get up and cook a meal. In the process, give thanks for all that went into the meal — the sacrifices of plants and animals, of others in our extended human community who planted, harvested and transported the ingredients, etc.

I believe there is power in trusting in God and in praying. I don’t believe that it is God’s will if the camel wanders off.

By: CEF

CEF — Thu, 02 Oct 2008 16:22:26 +0000

What would be your answer to a church that espouses education and at the same time teaches the gospel to the lowest common denominator?

By: Elliott

Elliott — Thu, 02 Oct 2008 16:19:27 +0000

Brilliant.